beckham :banned size 0
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kimmy
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i don't like any ban on any size models. you know, everyone used to say "there should be curves on the runway, it's not fair to exclude!" but now they're going to exclude the walking sticks? that's not fair either...it doesn't make it okay now that they're excluding the minority. it's still wrong, and it's still unfair.
and Victoria Beckham can sod off. so, is she not going to wear her own clothes? because i doubt she's anything more than a size 0.
and Victoria Beckham can sod off. so, is she not going to wear her own clothes? because i doubt she's anything more than a size 0.
Raerae
Well-known member
Quote:
She's not saying being thin is unhealthy. All she said was, "She wants to show that you dont have to be ultra thin to look good." I'm sure the models used will still be thinner than your "average" girl though. She'll just use sizes 2-4, which is still thin compare to the typical girl who's like a 10-12+
Edit - Got my thoughts mixed up on the Beckham quote, fixed.
Originally Posted by Beauty Mark
If "the source" is right that she wants to make a statement regarding how thin and unhealthy models are, it isn't about industry and playing to the PR. |
She's not saying being thin is unhealthy. All she said was, "She wants to show that you dont have to be ultra thin to look good." I'm sure the models used will still be thinner than your "average" girl though. She'll just use sizes 2-4, which is still thin compare to the typical girl who's like a 10-12+
Edit - Got my thoughts mixed up on the Beckham quote, fixed.
little teaser
Well-known member
Quote:
your right i read the same thing, she isnt happy with her body after kids she even said she looks bad with out clothes, i think she tried to lose her belly sag and lost everything but that, instead of dieting she should of got a small tummy tuck to get rid of the extra skin.
still i dont think its fair to ban size 0 models
| Originally Posted by lemurian
I'm not a fan of hers at all, but I have read some interviews with her where she's extremely honest and self-depricating about her poor self-image. In one she talked about how she didn't intend to be so skinny, just for her stomach to be firm again after having her kiddies, which I can certainly sympathize with. Some tummies just don't spring back, and I've seen other, non-famous women waste away trying to get back their pre-pregnancy shape 
Then again maybe she doesn't want any models thinner than her modelling her clothes, ha!! |
your right i read the same thing, she isnt happy with her body after kids she even said she looks bad with out clothes, i think she tried to lose her belly sag and lost everything but that, instead of dieting she should of got a small tummy tuck to get rid of the extra skin.
still i dont think its fair to ban size 0 models
kimmy
Well-known member
Quote:
they'll still make size 0s of course, because my money is just as good as anyone else's...it's just kind of upsetting that now the fashion world is telling me that while my money is as good as everyone else's, my body isn't.
on the runway, clothes should be modelled by people of ALL shapes and sizes, even the smaller ones.
| Originally Posted by Raerae
Just cuz the models on the run way wont be size0, doesn't mean they wont sell size 0 clothing. |
they'll still make size 0s of course, because my money is just as good as anyone else's...it's just kind of upsetting that now the fashion world is telling me that while my money is as good as everyone else's, my body isn't.
on the runway, clothes should be modelled by people of ALL shapes and sizes, even the smaller ones.
Beauty Mark
Well-known member
Quote:
The fashion world has been telling me that, by never using models close to my height (I'm 4'10.) Even petite models are like the average height of women. Plus-sized friends I think are similar.
It's a discriminatory business. I think it's good that they're examining their practices, because I believe it's unhealthy for most women to be almost 6 feet tall and weigh so little. So many runway models do crazy things to keep their weight down.
I too agree that they should just focus on using healthy women to model, though.
| the fashion world is telling me that while my money is as good as everyone else's, my body isn't. |
The fashion world has been telling me that, by never using models close to my height (I'm 4'10.) Even petite models are like the average height of women. Plus-sized friends I think are similar.
It's a discriminatory business. I think it's good that they're examining their practices, because I believe it's unhealthy for most women to be almost 6 feet tall and weigh so little. So many runway models do crazy things to keep their weight down.
I too agree that they should just focus on using healthy women to model, though.
kimmy
Well-known member
Quote:
exactly. i just think it's ironic though how everyone is in support of the skinny model bans because it doesn't exclude their demographic. thin people are people too, and it hurts us just as much as it does anyone else to be excluded.
that's nothing against you. i'm just saying that there seems to be overwhelming support for banning thin models and that disgusts me. sensitive issue for me i guess. it just pisses me off that it's okay to ban skinny people because we look "unhealthy" and because we "give young girls negative body images."
| Originally Posted by Beauty Mark
The fashion world has been telling me that, by never using models close to my height (I'm 4'10.) Even petite models are like the average height of women. Plus-sized friends I think are similar. |
exactly. i just think it's ironic though how everyone is in support of the skinny model bans because it doesn't exclude their demographic. thin people are people too, and it hurts us just as much as it does anyone else to be excluded.
that's nothing against you. i'm just saying that there seems to be overwhelming support for banning thin models and that disgusts me. sensitive issue for me i guess. it just pisses me off that it's okay to ban skinny people because we look "unhealthy" and because we "give young girls negative body images."
bAbY_cHiCkEn01
Well-known member
I almost feel as if she's just saying it so she can get on the "good" bandwagon along with other designers in spain and such but doesn't really give a toss. It's more about promotion in saying that I think. So it makes it seem like she cares but in reality, if she cared she'd bulk up and speak more publicly about weight and how starving isn't a good thing etc etc...
Beauty Mark
Well-known member
Quote:
One of the backfiring aspects of being okay with one's weight is that some people degrade others to feel good about themselves or make that statement.
I think they should personally choose models who are healthy, which would include thin, slightly overweight, average, curvy, etc.
Not that I pity them, but I don't think the fashion industry will ever quite win this one. Even if they do what I suggest, women who are unhealthily under or over weight would complain.
| Originally Posted by THE ANTHEM
exactly. i just think it's ironic though how everyone is in support of the skinny model bans because it doesn't exclude their demographic. thin people are people too, and it hurts us just as much as it does anyone else to be excluded. that's nothing against you. i'm just saying that there seems to be overwhelming support for banning thin models and that disgusts me. sensitive issue for me i guess. it just pisses me off that it's okay to ban skinny people because we look "unhealthy" and because we "give young girls negative body images." |
One of the backfiring aspects of being okay with one's weight is that some people degrade others to feel good about themselves or make that statement.
I think they should personally choose models who are healthy, which would include thin, slightly overweight, average, curvy, etc.
Not that I pity them, but I don't think the fashion industry will ever quite win this one. Even if they do what I suggest, women who are unhealthily under or over weight would complain.
lemurian
Well-known member
Quote:
It is not a discriminatory business -- their goal is to sell clothes, and clothes look better on tall, thin women. The fashion industry is not trying to promote an ideal body type! They are not responsible for women feeling bad about themselves, WOMEN ARE. And for you to say that being extremely short or overweight is somehow healthier than being tall and thin is absurd and pretty hypocritical, IMO. As if there aren't any short women who starve themselves (hello, Nicole Richie, Lindsey Lohan, Kate Bosworth). Nobody has ever said that being tall and thin is better for the sake of health, just that it's better for the sake of fashion. And I agree. Which is why I don't bother buying designer clothes
Hey, more $$$ in my pocket for MAC!
| Originally Posted by Beauty Mark
The fashion world has been telling me that, by never using models close to my height (I'm 4'10.) Even petite models are like the average height of women. Plus-sized friends I think are similar. It's a discriminatory business. I think it's good that they're examining their practices, because I believe it's unhealthy for most women to be almost 6 feet tall and weigh so little. So many runway models do crazy things to keep their weight down. I too agree that they should just focus on using healthy women to model, though. |
It is not a discriminatory business -- their goal is to sell clothes, and clothes look better on tall, thin women. The fashion industry is not trying to promote an ideal body type! They are not responsible for women feeling bad about themselves, WOMEN ARE. And for you to say that being extremely short or overweight is somehow healthier than being tall and thin is absurd and pretty hypocritical, IMO. As if there aren't any short women who starve themselves (hello, Nicole Richie, Lindsey Lohan, Kate Bosworth). Nobody has ever said that being tall and thin is better for the sake of health, just that it's better for the sake of fashion. And I agree. Which is why I don't bother buying designer clothes
Hey, more $$$ in my pocket for MAC!
Beauty Mark
Well-known member
Quote:
You aren't reading my post correctly. I never accused the fashion industry of causing eating disorders and body complexes. I personally believe that the people you surround yourself with or your parents are more of a likely culprit, like if your parents constantly make you think you're overweight as a child or insist that being skinny is the end all, be all of the world. I think examining their practices is good, for the sake of young girls in modeling. I don't think most women look at models as examples of what they should like; I think celebrities are sadly used as role models. If they're making statements about body acceptance, good for them.
I don't agree at all that clothes look better on tall, thin women. Some clothes, for instance, look breathtakingly better on a woman with breasts or an ass than one without. Some clothes look better on a woman who's completely flat. If you've seen a "Who wore it better?" pic, comparing a model in designer clothes to someone else like Beyonce, sometimes the results are significantly better. The modeling/fashion runway world chooses to use thin women.
I never said also that it's better to be overweight or short or whatever have you. I'm just making a point that I will never work runway, because I'm too short by the current industry standard (I'm actually perfectly within acceptable weight for my body size and proportional and all that jazz.) I look fabulous in clothes I wear, and I know I could strut down a runway. There's no reason why I couldn't model, because I can complete the tasks required. They do discriminate based on height and size.
| It is not a discriminatory business -- their goal is to sell clothes, and clothes look better on tall, thin women. The fashion industry is not trying to promote an ideal body type! They are not responsible for women feeling bad about themselves, WOMEN ARE. And for you to say that being extremely short or overweight is somehow healthier than being tall and thin is absurd and pretty hypocritical, IMO. As if there aren't any short women who starve themselves (hello, Nicole Richie, Lindsey Lohan, Kate Bosworth). Nobody has ever said that being tall and thin is better for the sake of health, just that it's better for the sake of fashion. And I agree. Which is why I don't bother buying designer clothes Hey, more $$$ in my pocket for MAC! |
You aren't reading my post correctly. I never accused the fashion industry of causing eating disorders and body complexes. I personally believe that the people you surround yourself with or your parents are more of a likely culprit, like if your parents constantly make you think you're overweight as a child or insist that being skinny is the end all, be all of the world. I think examining their practices is good, for the sake of young girls in modeling. I don't think most women look at models as examples of what they should like; I think celebrities are sadly used as role models. If they're making statements about body acceptance, good for them.
I don't agree at all that clothes look better on tall, thin women. Some clothes, for instance, look breathtakingly better on a woman with breasts or an ass than one without. Some clothes look better on a woman who's completely flat. If you've seen a "Who wore it better?" pic, comparing a model in designer clothes to someone else like Beyonce, sometimes the results are significantly better. The modeling/fashion runway world chooses to use thin women.
I never said also that it's better to be overweight or short or whatever have you. I'm just making a point that I will never work runway, because I'm too short by the current industry standard (I'm actually perfectly within acceptable weight for my body size and proportional and all that jazz.) I look fabulous in clothes I wear, and I know I could strut down a runway. There's no reason why I couldn't model, because I can complete the tasks required. They do discriminate based on height and size.
lemurian
Well-known member
Quote:
Haha.. I read your post just fine, thanks. And my reply was to the point, but I think you're missing the point. You may as well be saying that the NBA is discriminatory! Just because you and your plus-sized friends don't see people like yourselves modelling clothes doesn't mean it is unfair, that's just the business of high fashion.
And in an ironic twist, I happen to be fairly tall and had to wear mens pants throughout high school because it was near-impossible to find reasonably priced women's jeans with a long-enough inseam for me. Of course there are petite sizes and plus sizes and even PETITE STORES and PLUS SIZE STORES galore
Hooray for tall women finally having their day!
| Originally Posted by Beauty Mark
You aren't reading my post correctly. |
Haha.. I read your post just fine, thanks. And my reply was to the point, but I think you're missing the point. You may as well be saying that the NBA is discriminatory! Just because you and your plus-sized friends don't see people like yourselves modelling clothes doesn't mean it is unfair, that's just the business of high fashion.
And in an ironic twist, I happen to be fairly tall and had to wear mens pants throughout high school because it was near-impossible to find reasonably priced women's jeans with a long-enough inseam for me. Of course there are petite sizes and plus sizes and even PETITE STORES and PLUS SIZE STORES galore
Beauty Mark
Well-known member
You didn't read my post correctly, because I didn't say anything about
the fashion industry giving complexes. I said that
Quote:
I never said that I believe their messages, much like I don't believe tabloids that claim Elvis was spotted somewhere.
Your analogy doesn't work, because height is an advantage to playing basketball well. The goal of playing basketball is that you try to score as many baskets as possible. You have to be able to reach the basket with the ball. It's like swimmers are very thin because of resistance or being able to lift certain amounts of weight for a lot of different jobs.
There's no real advantage to having tall women modeling clothes. To model clothes, you just need to be able to look good in them, walk properly, and that isn't relevant to height or being extremely skinny. There are plenty of short women, tall women, average height women, thin women, plus-sized women, etc. who look great in clothes. There are styles that everyone can pull off and styles only some can pull off.
However, it is their right to do that, but it is discriminatory. I never said that they shouldn't be allowed to do that.
More on topic, I'm against anything that encourages its participants to engage in unhealthy and deadly practices, particularly since many of these people are young teenagers. Dance (ballet; I had a dance teacher who told me that she knew dancers who would have their ribs break when they were lifted), gymnastics, you name it.
the fashion industry giving complexes. I said that
Quote:
| The fashion world has been telling me that, by never using models close to my height (I'm 4'10.) |
I never said that I believe their messages, much like I don't believe tabloids that claim Elvis was spotted somewhere.
Your analogy doesn't work, because height is an advantage to playing basketball well. The goal of playing basketball is that you try to score as many baskets as possible. You have to be able to reach the basket with the ball. It's like swimmers are very thin because of resistance or being able to lift certain amounts of weight for a lot of different jobs.
There's no real advantage to having tall women modeling clothes. To model clothes, you just need to be able to look good in them, walk properly, and that isn't relevant to height or being extremely skinny. There are plenty of short women, tall women, average height women, thin women, plus-sized women, etc. who look great in clothes. There are styles that everyone can pull off and styles only some can pull off.
However, it is their right to do that, but it is discriminatory. I never said that they shouldn't be allowed to do that.
More on topic, I'm against anything that encourages its participants to engage in unhealthy and deadly practices, particularly since many of these people are young teenagers. Dance (ballet; I had a dance teacher who told me that she knew dancers who would have their ribs break when they were lifted), gymnastics, you name it.
Jade
Well-known member
Quote:
I agree with you here. I Think she is doing it because everyone else is doing it. I'm sure if it wasn't so frowned upon now, she would have size zero models on the runway. Not that that's necessarily a bad thing. There are a lot of size zero women out there that don't get that way by starving themselves, they are perfectly healthy.
| Originally Posted by bAbY_cHiCkEn01
I almost feel as if she's just saying it so she can get on the "good" bandwagon along with other designers in spain and such but doesn't really give a toss. It's more about promotion in saying that I think. So it makes it seem like she cares but in reality, if she cared she'd bulk up and speak more publicly about weight and how starving isn't a good thing etc etc... |
I agree with you here. I Think she is doing it because everyone else is doing it. I'm sure if it wasn't so frowned upon now, she would have size zero models on the runway. Not that that's necessarily a bad thing. There are a lot of size zero women out there that don't get that way by starving themselves, they are perfectly healthy.
Raerae
Well-known member
Quote:
Actually, if you compared a "short average" woman, and a tall slim model in the same clothing, the tall slim model will look signifigantly better than the shorter girl. They will be easier to see, because they are bigger for one, and the lines of their body will look nicer as well. Not to mention the taller slimmer model will be able to wear all the outfits that look nice on the "short average" girl, but also wear outfits that would look terrible on a shorter model.
Take stripes as an example. If you had an "average" woman in the United states modeling a top with horizontal stripes, and a typical model, who do you think the outfit will end up looking more pleasing on? Chances are your "average" model will look like a watermelon compared to the model. Being taller and skinnier, also allows you to wear patterns that shorter wider frames are unable too. As your body has longer vertical lines. It's not that a shorter person can't wear them, but that they will look BETTER on a taller thinner person.
In addition clothing that is more "revealing" will look better on a taller thinner model. She will have longer and more graceful legs and arms. Clothing like a mini skirt, always looks better on someone who has long legs, compared to someone who is shorter. You ever look at Mini skirts on the rack? The larger the size, the larger the skirt. So thinner models inherently get to wear "shorter" and sexier mini's than bigger girls. Not to mention having better looking legs to go along with it. Yeh, you could cut the size 12 skirt to be as short as the size 0 skirt, but it's going to look very out of proportion. Same with swimwear/and intimate apparel. Do you really wanna look at a size 12 girl in a thong strutting down the runway? ewww.
So while yes, anyone could model, but when given the choice, you might as well choose the model who will make your clothing look the BEST. Which is a tall, thin girl, not your "average" american. Why give yourself an inherant disadvantage in the industry when your trying to get a buyer for your collection, by making your clothing look worse than it has to be.
| Originally Posted by Beauty Mark
There's no real advantage to having tall women modeling clothes. To model clothes, you just need to be able to look good in them, walk properly, and that isn't relevant to height or being extremely skinny. There are plenty of short women, tall women, average height women, thin women, plus-sized women, etc. who look great in clothes. There are styles that everyone can pull off and styles only some can pull off. |
Actually, if you compared a "short average" woman, and a tall slim model in the same clothing, the tall slim model will look signifigantly better than the shorter girl. They will be easier to see, because they are bigger for one, and the lines of their body will look nicer as well. Not to mention the taller slimmer model will be able to wear all the outfits that look nice on the "short average" girl, but also wear outfits that would look terrible on a shorter model.
Take stripes as an example. If you had an "average" woman in the United states modeling a top with horizontal stripes, and a typical model, who do you think the outfit will end up looking more pleasing on? Chances are your "average" model will look like a watermelon compared to the model. Being taller and skinnier, also allows you to wear patterns that shorter wider frames are unable too. As your body has longer vertical lines. It's not that a shorter person can't wear them, but that they will look BETTER on a taller thinner person.
In addition clothing that is more "revealing" will look better on a taller thinner model. She will have longer and more graceful legs and arms. Clothing like a mini skirt, always looks better on someone who has long legs, compared to someone who is shorter. You ever look at Mini skirts on the rack? The larger the size, the larger the skirt. So thinner models inherently get to wear "shorter" and sexier mini's than bigger girls. Not to mention having better looking legs to go along with it. Yeh, you could cut the size 12 skirt to be as short as the size 0 skirt, but it's going to look very out of proportion. Same with swimwear/and intimate apparel. Do you really wanna look at a size 12 girl in a thong strutting down the runway? ewww.
So while yes, anyone could model, but when given the choice, you might as well choose the model who will make your clothing look the BEST. Which is a tall, thin girl, not your "average" american. Why give yourself an inherant disadvantage in the industry when your trying to get a buyer for your collection, by making your clothing look worse than it has to be.
MxAxC-_ATTACK
Well-known member
I could honestly care less about who is walking down a fashion week runway. Thin slim models have never made me feel bad about myself. and if they are healthy. who cares. Just because someone is a size 0 or a size 18 doesnt make them unhealthy, It doesn't make them more attractive, OR less attractive than anyone else, seeing as how the people doing the judging of women,(usually men) ALL have different tastes in body types
Besides , The most looked at women in Lingerie, aren't size zeros at all..
Victoria Secret anyone ?
and a close second would be Playboy Models, has anyone seen "The Girls next door" ? IMO-Those girls are hot, and they are larger than size zeros for SURE, except maybe Kendra..who is quite small BUT still pretty
all of them look good. I think its just what you feel is healthy for yourself that people should be worried about. Don't worry about Kate Moss... or nicole Richie... I am sure they can handle themselves.
I think people should worry about the Hideous clothing that the designers are putting on these poor girls sometimes.. what are those.. my grandmothers old drapes??THOSE wont look good on ANYONE.
Besides , The most looked at women in Lingerie, aren't size zeros at all..
Victoria Secret anyone ?
and a close second would be Playboy Models, has anyone seen "The Girls next door" ? IMO-Those girls are hot, and they are larger than size zeros for SURE, except maybe Kendra..who is quite small BUT still pretty
all of them look good. I think its just what you feel is healthy for yourself that people should be worried about. Don't worry about Kate Moss... or nicole Richie... I am sure they can handle themselves.
I think people should worry about the Hideous clothing that the designers are putting on these poor girls sometimes.. what are those.. my grandmothers old drapes??THOSE wont look good on ANYONE.
MxAxC-_ATTACK
Well-known member
Side note
Posh was always my Favorite Spice ! haha
Posh was always my Favorite Spice ! haha
Jade
Well-known member
Quote:
Agreed. Keep in mind that a lot of designer clothing is, unfortunately, designed for thinner women. They usually only come in small sizes. I'm not a size zero, I'm a size 8. I can't even fit into alot of that stuff, unless I squeeze into it. Although I am not a size zero, I don't think for the most part that a lot of women who are, are unhealthy at all. My sister is a zero and she is healthy. She doesn't starve herself, she's athletic. She doesn't look emaciated in any way. She's just built that way. I agree with RaeRae in that the thinner, taller models do represent these clothes better. I mean, honestly, I think my sister would look better in these clothes than I would.
| Originally Posted by Raerae
Actually, if you compared a "short average" woman, and a tall slim model in the same clothing, the tall slim model will look signifigantly better than the shorter girl. They will be easier to see, because they are bigger for one, and the lines of their body will look nicer as well. Not to mention the taller slimmer model will be able to wear all the outfits that look nice on the "short average" girl, but also wear outfits that would look terrible on a shorter model. Take stripes as an example. If you had an "average" woman in the United states modeling a top with horizontal stripes, and a typical model, who do you think the outfit will end up looking more pleasing on? Chances are your "average" model will look like a watermelon compared to the model. Being taller and skinnier, also allows you to wear patterns that shorter wider frames are unable too. As your body has longer vertical lines. It's not that a shorter person can't wear them, but that they will look BETTER on a taller thinner person. In addition clothing that is more "revealing" will look better on a taller thinner model. She will have longer and more graceful legs and arms. Clothing like a mini skirt, always looks better on someone who has long legs, compared to someone who is shorter. You ever look at Mini skirts on the rack? The larger the size, the larger the skirt. So thinner models inherently get to wear "shorter" and sexier mini's than bigger girls. Not to mention having better looking legs to go along with it. Yeh, you could cut the size 12 skirt to be as short as the size 0 skirt, but it's going to look very out of proportion. Same with swimwear/and intimate apparel. Do you really wanna look at a size 12 girl in a thong strutting down the runway? ewww. So while yes, anyone could model, but when given the choice, you might as well choose the model who will make your clothing look the BEST. Which is a tall, thin girl, not your "average" american. Why give yourself an inherant disadvantage in the industry when your trying to get a buyer for your collection, by making your clothing look worse than it has to be. |
Agreed. Keep in mind that a lot of designer clothing is, unfortunately, designed for thinner women. They usually only come in small sizes. I'm not a size zero, I'm a size 8. I can't even fit into alot of that stuff, unless I squeeze into it. Although I am not a size zero, I don't think for the most part that a lot of women who are, are unhealthy at all. My sister is a zero and she is healthy. She doesn't starve herself, she's athletic. She doesn't look emaciated in any way. She's just built that way. I agree with RaeRae in that the thinner, taller models do represent these clothes better. I mean, honestly, I think my sister would look better in these clothes than I would.
