Eyes before Foundation...

[shabdebaz]

Here is something that can cause a little debate/discussion!

After I got certified for my Application Skills a few months ago, the Senior Trainer sat down with me and we went through what I did together. They go through a checklist and discuss every point with everyone who goes through this process.

When she asked me if I had any questions, I specifically asked her about the 'doing the eyes before foundation' thing...if it really matters what you do first (I personally never even thought of doing the eyes first until I saw some co-workers doing it for their appointments). Her answer kind of surprised me. She said that you shouldn't need to do the eyes first with the proper tools and technique. I thought about that and I guess it's true...whenever I have seen a makeup artist on TV or even one of our Senior Artists in Training doing a makeup, I have never seen them do eyes first.

I honestly thought she was going to say that the order doesn't matter as long as you get the job done beautifully and the client is satisfied.

I just thought I would mention this since a lot of people ask this question. What do you all think? Do you think that this could be a measure of an artists' skill level?

 

[amoona]

I've always had MAC MAs do the eyes first. Personally I do eyes first when I'm using pigments or if I'm using a lot of black eyeshadow on my lid. Those tend to have a lot of fall out so I can easily just take a wipe and clean it up and then start the foundation.

But it just depends on what I'm doing. Sometimes I'll even do half of the eyes and then apply the foundation and then finish the eyes. haha there's no method to my madness.

 

[madkitty]

I had to do a photo shoot once and the MA did face first

 

[d_flawless]

that makes sense, because the only reason you'd really do your eyes first is because of product fallout, which ruins the foundation.

 

[FacesbyNiki]

I like doing the eyes first because you know how picky the can be. You do the foundation first and then the eyes and they hate it. so it's easier to clean off the eyes rather than redoing the whole face. At least for me it is.

 

[prinzessin784]

I always do my face first and I've never really had a problem with fallout. Do people really apply so sloppily that it gets all over their face? Controlled movements people!

Besides, I apply concealer first, then foundation (to blend the two into each other) and then powder. I put foundation on my eyelids and powder all over my entire face. I do all of that first so I don't have powder dulling the look of my eye makeup and so it doesn't get in my brow wax and look nasty.

 

[lara]

If you need to do the eyes first because of fall-out or other product drifting, you need to seriously look at your technique. I can agree with doing the eyes first if you're doing something particularly intricate that may require several stop-starts, but beyond that, nope.

(for me it's foundation and concealing, eyebrows, eye design, lipstick, cheeks.)

 

[martygreene]

Quote:

Originally Posted by lara If you need to do the eyes first because of fall-out or other product drifting, you need to seriously look at your technique. I can agree with doing the eyes first if you're doing something particularly intricate that may require several stop-starts, but beyond that, nope. (for me it's foundation and concealing, eyebrows, eye design, lipstick, cheeks.)

Your technique, and your PRODUCTS. If you're having that much issue with fallout/drifting, you need to look at the tools and actual color products that you're using. You really shouldn't have this issue. Yet another reason that MAC products are no longer appropriate for professional use (compaired to other PRO brands, and their previous incarnations).

 

[amoona]

Hmm that's weird cuz the only reason I even thought to do eyes first was after going to a MAC seminar and having the trainer say that it's just easier to do it that way.

I also don't have mixing medium to mix my pigments with so idk if that's what causes pigments to fall onto my cheeks. It's weird too cuz it's not usually with every color.

 

[maxcat]

Might just be your trainer's opinion. I used to do "dropclothing" (as reccomended by Kevin Aucoin when doing heavy eye makeup) by putting a tonne of loose blot underneath in the "danger zone".
Then a MAC trainer at update last year said an easier option was to do the eyes, clean up after and do everything else. Damn straight - because you can do really dewy great skin rather than getting bloody blot powder all over everything.
So... I'd ask another trainer. My resident trainer sees us do it all the time and has never said boo.

 

[MACtastic]

At work, I like to do the eyes first when my client is trying on some new colors. That way, if they don't like it, its much easier to go back and try again with a new look. If I'm doing a standard makeup lesson, I do the face first.
Oh, and another question: what products ARE appropriate for professional use?

 

[martygreene]

Quote:

Originally Posted by MACtastic At work, I like to do the eyes first when my client is trying on some new colors. That way, if they don't like it, its much easier to go back and try again with a new look. If I'm doing a standard makeup lesson, I do the face first. Oh, and another question: what products ARE appropriate for professional use?

Check the Industry Discussion FAQ (stickied at the top of this forum), there is a lot of information there on this subject.

 

[claresauntie]

Quote:

Originally Posted by martygreene Check the Industry Discussion FAQ (stickied at the top of this forum), there is a lot of information there on this subject.

I'm sorry, but can you be a bit more specific? Which link has this info? I see Mary Erickson's site had a question that partially mentioned this, but she didn't really address that portion of the question other than to say "try cream eyeshadow" which is not really helpful. Otherwise, I don't see anything...? I must be looking in the wrong place.

 

[martygreene]

Suggestions for foundations/products for my kit? What is in your kit?
http://madenyc.com/artistchoice.html
http://specktra.net/showthread.php?t=43400
http://specktra.net/showthread.php?t=49528
http://specktra.net/showthread.php?t=45268
http://specktra.net/showthread.php?t=42937

Specifically that first link

 

[MisStarrlight]

It makes sense, but it seems that at MAC either way is appropriate.

I do the face first, just cause that's the habit I've gotten into.
But if I'm using pigments/working with a client that seems like they're going to change their mind a lot, I try to remember to do their eyes before the face.

 

[claresauntie]

Quote:

Originally Posted by martygreene Suggestions for foundations/products for my kit? What is in your kit? http://madenyc.com/artistchoice.html http://specktra.net/showthread.php?t=43400 http://specktra.net/showthread.php?t=49528 http://specktra.net/showthread.php?t=45268 http://specktra.net/showthread.php?t=42937 Specifically that first link

*big dramatic sigh*

I can't get the first link to work at all. I skimmed through the 2nd one and didn't see what i'm looking for, but will read again with the others tonight when i can give it 100% of my attention.

Thanks for the attempted assist. I'm sure it's the info I need and I just can't find it.

 

[ms.marymac]

Quote:

Originally Posted by FacesbyNiki I like doing the eyes first because you know how picky the can be. You do the foundation first and then the eyes and they hate it. so it's easier to clean off the eyes rather than redoing the whole face. At least for me it is.

Same here. If I am doing a dramatic look, I tend to reach for pigments a lot too so it helps to do the eyes first. I usually don't have a lot of fallout though.

I can't think of a reason why it would be imperative to do the foundation first. :shrug:

Edited to wonder why the shrugging smilie has to roll his eyes. lol

 

[sharyn]

Some people get allergic reactions to eyeliners and mascara, and when I am not sure if someone will be okay with the kind of eyemake up I put on, I do eyes first. Simply because it will not ruin the whole face in case she/he has to wash it off because of an allergic reaction.

You can also never be sure that the people you put the make up on will be perfect customers who dont have to sneeze after you just put on mascara or turn their head the second you apply eyeliner. I find the mess a lot easier to clean up if the customer doesnt have foundation on.

But personally, I really dont care just how someone does it as long as it looks good. You can have the finest brushes and most brilliant technique in the world and pick the wrong colors and it's all gonna be effed up. As long as there's no huge undereye circles or mascara all over the face I'm fine.

 

[maxcat]

I guess the difference is working on smoky panda eyes at the counter vs. in the field. If you've got your own gear with a compliant model who isn't a fidgitmonster... but at the counter you get confronted with someone who wants smokey eys... you don't know how squirmy they're going to be - and more importantly its usually something they want to be able to recreate. Eyes first for people who don't have training or all the pro gear is the easiest way. As for the field, hey. Whatever floats your boat. Kevin Aucoin used to make people lie flat on their backs while he did their makeup.

 

[Miss Thing]

I never did eyes first, I just never felt I needed to. I like a nice prepped eye based under & over the lid, so If I was to have a problem with pigment dropping (-haha that sounds funny), I would have to re-prep the eye anyway. Powder underneath could be good but sometimes can make the skin ashy and ruin a dewy look. I guess I would only consider basing after if I was doing a really elaborate eye.