White Supremacist plot to assassinate Barack Obama foiled

[ms.marymac]

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Originally Posted by TISH1127 The sad thing is..I can't say that I am surprised....wish I could act shocked...But unfortunately....Most people that are honest with themselves knew this would happen. The really sad and heart wrenching part is that this is probably only the beginning of worse attempts to come. Fighting for people's rights sometimes put your own life in harms way. Especially, when you have a big voice and people see it is being listened to. The only way they feel they can stop people from listening is by stopping the person who is talking by whatever means possible. I just keep praying that God will keep him and his family safe. This is the world as we know it...Some people are just cruel and have no regard to human life. Deep seeded racism still exists and it always will.

This is so true. It's such BS. I hope these two idiots drop the soap A LOT in prison...karma can be a bitch.

 

[florabundance]

In the same way that the US Gov. are seemingly allowed to detain people in Guantanamo based only on suspicion, then these "neo-nazis" similarly should be detained and treated like the animals that they are regardless of whether they physically act on their extremist beliefs.

While a man like Obama is trying to teach HOPE and CHANGE, the media puts those two little Nazi sisters who are recording artists into the newspapers, on tv and treat them as a though they are commodity - trying to get us to laugh at the ignorance of their parents and their society. "Dumb Americans from the backward south". Well they're not dumb they're fucking dangerous, disgusting people.

 

[PMBG83]

Same not surprised. Then to see some of these idiots and what they same on live tv about him makes me wanna take a nicely heeled gladitor boot to the back of their heads. Now as franimal mentioned about the poverty bit that goes back to an old theory. Once youve been told that you can do no wrong b/c of your skin color youre the smartest etc. etc. then successful smart doctors professors of other races start to come about and the skys the limit...you have to rely on "well at least were still this color". Which I know is at least part (if not all)of the case here.

 

[xxManBeaterxx]

Wow there are really no words to describe the hatered and stupidity of these individuals, it makes me so angry. One thing for sure, is that i am extremely glad they got caught before any innocent lives and families were destroyed.

Im sure they wont get lifetime in jail, so what will happen when they do get released? Can these young men ever function safely when they are free to live with the general public again someday? I doubt it, and that scares the shit out of me.

 

[*Stargazer*]

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Originally Posted by florabundance the media puts those two little Nazi sisters who are recording artists into the newspapers, on tv and treat them as a though they are commodity - trying to get us to laugh at the ignorance of their parents and their society. "Dumb Americans from the backward south". Well they're not dumb they're fucking dangerous, disgusting people.

Those Prussian Blue chicks scare the bejesus out of me. I am quite literally frightened of them.

 

[Shimmer]

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Originally Posted by florabundance In the same way that the US Gov. are seemingly allowed to detain people in Guantanamo based only on suspicion, then these "neo-nazis" similarly should be detained and treated like the animals that they are regardless of whether they physically act on their extremist beliefs. While a man like Obama is trying to teach HOPE and CHANGE, the media puts those two little Nazi sisters who are recording artists into the newspapers, on tv and treat them as a though they are commodity - trying to get us to laugh at the ignorance of their parents and their society. "Dumb Americans from the backward south". Well they're not dumb they're fucking dangerous, disgusting people.

Essentially, the premise is "I may not agree with what you have to say, but I'll defend to the death your right to say it."
To some Obama's message is hopeful. To others, Obama's message is one that isn't quite so positive.
Either way, killing the man, or seriously entertaining the thought of doing so, is wrong.

 

[florabundance]

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Originally Posted by Shimmer Essentially, the premise is "I may not agree with what you have to say, but I'll defend to the death your right to say it."

Right. But it bothers me that that only applies to some but not to others. Obviously, promoting any kind of hatred is horrific, but "Islamic extremists" in Britain have been arrested for inciting hatred, standard civilians have been subjected to a quite invasive stop and search policy on the grounds of their appearance. THEN there's the whole Jean Charles de Menezes incident, an innocent man killed. Why is it that these people (all different circumstances though they may be) can not be defended, yet neo-Nazi ideals are seen as "freedom of speech"?

 

[Shimmer]

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Originally Posted by florabundance Right. But it bothers me that that only applies to some but not to others. Obviously, promoting any kind of hatred is horrific, but "Islamic extremists" in Britain have been arrested for inciting hatred, standard civilians have been subjected to a quite invasive stop and search policy on the grounds of their appearance. THEN there's the whole Jean Charles de Menezes incident, an innocent man killed. Why is it that these people (all different circumstances though they may be) can not be defended, yet neo-Nazi ideals are seen as "freedom of speech"?

*Most* of the time the neo-Nazi ideal is one that isn't acted on, anymore. I lived in a city where there was a KKK rally. Spookiest fucking shit I ever saw, but peaceful as a rally could get.
Freedom of Speech being suppressed always gets to me because how many American newspapers ran editorials of the Muhammed cartoon that sparked so much controversy? Few, if any, because of the fear of reprisal. The fear that there would be some kind of retribution like happened elsewhere kept them from publishing the cartoon, and I don't agree with that viewpoint.

 

[florabundance]

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Originally Posted by Shimmer *Most* of the time the neo-Nazi ideal is one that isn't acted on, anymore. I lived in a city where there was a KKK rally. Spookiest fucking shit I ever saw, but peaceful as a rally could get. Freedom of Speech being suppressed always gets to me because how many American newspapers ran editorials of the Muhammed cartoon that sparked so much controversy? Few, if any, because of the fear of reprisal. The fear that there would be some kind of retribution like happened elsewhere kept them from publishing the cartoon, and I don't agree with that viewpoint.

The publication of the Muhammad cartoon, to me, was more an issue of different ideals between the East and West. The concept of trivialising religions or people of authority etc. is a very recent and very Western thing. In the East, it is not. Just the same as some modern Western people cannot grasp the idea of a woman covering up or of polygamous, patriarchal family units. There is no right or wrong here, to me, these are cultural differences for no one to denounce.

However, Nazism is not a culture, it is an ignorance. It promotes a violent ideology based on false, biased scientific and historical information widely discredited by not just one group of people, but the entire world..anyone with a brain. Suppose a black person happened to attend this "peaceful" KKK rally you stumbled upon. Would it have remained so? I seriously doubt it..The point i'm trying to make is that the danger is always there that these people will also act on their craziness, and when it comes to other issues, there are policies introduced to take measures to enure that that doesnt happen.

 

[Shimmer]

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Originally Posted by florabundance The publication of the Muhammad cartoon, to me, was more an issue of different ideals between the East and West. The concept of trivialising religions or people of authority etc. is a very recent and very Western thing. In the East, it is not. Just the same as some modern Western people cannot grasp the idea of a woman covering up or of polygamous, patriarchal family units. There is no right or wrong here, to me, these are cultural differences for no one to denounce.

That doesn't make them acceptable. The fundamental viewpoint of ANY religion or culture can be (and usually is) not only oppressive to women but outright violent toward them.
Polygamy is actually something that has been spread through the west, but it's more amongst tribal cultures...except Mormons, but we're not going there.
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However, Nazism is not a culture, it is an ignorance. It promotes a violent ideology based on false, biased scientific and historical information widely discredited by not just one group of people, but the entire world..anyone with a brain. Suppose a black person happened to attend this "peaceful" KKK rally you stumbled upon. Would it have remained so? I seriously doubt it..

By definition, one is not necessarily violent to be a white supremacist (I don't agree with their viewpoint, let me reiterate that before I get more email from people telling me what a racist person I am)...
By your argument, Islam could be categorized the same way. There is no way (arguably) to follow Islam based on its principles and be a peaceful person, when the basis of the religion is that 'infidels' be killed. It promotes a violent ideology as well, one that's based in faith instead of faulty science, but a violent ideology nonetheless.

 

[florabundance]

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Originally Posted by Shimmer It promotes a violent ideology as well, one that's based in faith instead of faulty science, but a violent ideology nonetheless.

Dude, that's some offensive shit.
I'm just going to withdraw from this discussion, as I feel you are very minimally educated regarding Islamic religion (forgive me if i'm wrong or have misjudged) and respectfully disagree with you. We've gone way off topic.

EDIT: I'm not speaking as a Muslim, but as someone that has studied Islam.

 

[Shimmer]

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Originally Posted by florabundance Dude, that's some offensive shit. I'm just going to withdraw from this discussion, as I feel you are very minimally educated regarding Islamic religion (forgive me if i'm wrong or have misjudged) and respectfully disagree with you. We've gone way off topic. EDIT: I'm not speaking as a Muslim, but as someone that has studied Islam.

I apologize for offending you. It's certainly not my intent or desire to do that.

 

[ShugAvery2001]

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Originally Posted by Shimmer *Most* of the time the neo-Nazi ideal is one that isn't acted on, anymore. I lived in a city where there was a KKK rally. Spookiest fucking shit I ever saw, but peaceful as a rally could get. Freedom of Speech being suppressed always gets to me because how many American newspapers ran editorials of the Muhammed cartoon that sparked so much controversy? Few, if any, because of the fear of reprisal. The fear that there would be some kind of retribution like happened elsewhere kept them from publishing the cartoon, and I don't agree with that viewpoint.

what do you think the KKK would go around hanging negroes and jews in the light of day huh...

In your opinion, would you consider the KKK a terrorist organization?

 

[Shimmer]

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Originally Posted by ShugAvery2001 what do you think the KKK would go around hanging negroes and jews in the light of day huh... In your opinion, would you consider the KKK a terrorist organization?

It sounds like you're asking me if I'm a white supremacist.




To respond to your question though, I consider any group who uses violence, aggression, oppression, and intimidation to force their point of view, or to express their beliefs, or to harm another person/group/nation a terrorist group.

I don't care if someone is racist, whether they don't like whites, blacks, asians, eggplants, jews, grover, islam, whatever. A person's individual ideology is something they've a right to have, even if I disagree with it. They don't, however, have the right to harm another person to express their viewpoint. That's, for me, the line.

 

[ShugAvery2001]

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Originally Posted by Shimmer It sounds like you're asking me if I'm a white supremacist.

Nope... I asked your opinion..

Do you consider the KKK a terrorist organization.

The question is not an insinuation it's just a question

 

[Shimmer]

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Originally Posted by ShugAvery2001 Nope... I asked your opinion.. Do you consider the KKK a terrorist organization. The question is not an insinuation it's just a question

There's a insinuation there, because had I said 'no', I would have been accused of racism. That said, my previous post has my answer, and my answer doesn't change.

 

[ShugAvery2001]

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Originally Posted by Shimmer To respond to your question though, I consider any group who uses violence, aggression, oppression, and intimidation to force their point of view, or to express their beliefs, or to harm another person/group/nation a terrorist group. I don't care if someone is racist, whether they don't like whites, blacks, asians, eggplants, jews, grover, islam, whatever. A person's individual ideology is something they've a right to have, even if I disagree with it. They don't, however, have the right to harm another person to express their viewpoint. That's, for me, the line.

I agree with that

I asked the question because you seemed shocked that the klan had a peaceful rally. They've had many peaceful rally's thats not new. They have had rally's the skin heads have had rally's but as an organization they've also promoted AND executed VIOLENCE AND MURDER against people so ..
I wouldn't quite give them brownie points for having a peaceful rally.

 

[ShugAvery2001]

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Originally Posted by Shimmer There's a insinuation there, because had I said 'no', I would have been accused of racism. That said, my previous post has my answer, and my answer doesn't change.

Why are you so sensitive about being called a racist

Had you said no I would have asked you what your definition of a terrorist group was and how did they or didn't they fit that definition.

I mean to me any organization that murders innocents in the name of a political or otherwise ideological agenda should be considered a terrorist organization.

only trying to reason with you girlfriend stop being so defensive.

 

[Shimmer]

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Originally Posted by ShugAvery2001 Why are you so sensitive about being called a racist Had you said no I would have asked you what your definition of a terrorist group was and how did they or didn't they fit that definition. I mean to me any organization that murders innocents in the name of a political or otherwise ideological agenda should be considered a terrorist organization. only trying to reason with you girlfriend stop being so defensive.

To say I'm being defensive would be incorrect, to say that I want very precisely to convey my position on this particular issue would be correct. I'm very very careful, and very adamant, that my meaning be clear and concise. I don't want my verbiage misconstrued, and I don't want my meaning twisted, changed, or lost, particularly in light of discussions we've had in the past.

 

[Shimmer]

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Originally Posted by ShugAvery2001 I agree with that I asked the question because you seemed shocked that the klan had a peaceful rally. They've had many peaceful rally's thats not new. They have had rally's the skin heads have had rally's but as an organization they've also promoted AND executed VIOLENCE AND MURDER against people so .. I wouldn't quite give them brownie points for having a peaceful rally.

I wasn't shocked at all. It was a statement of observation.